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How the Right Recruiter Can Help You Solve Your Work-Life Balance Problem With Dr. John Mehall

Burnout Prevention, by Jen Barna MD, Physician Burnout, Physician Coaching, Physician Retention, Physician Side Gig, Physician Wellness, Podcast, Work Life Balance, Work Life Integration

In this episode, we talk to Dr. John Mehall about how the right recruiter can help physicians find their ideal work-life balance.

“There is no perfect job that will find you because you have to know what you’re looking for and either find that or create that.”

-John Mehall MD, MBA, FACS, FAC

Our guest, Dr. John Mehall, Chief Medical Officer for Curative/Doximity, talks with cohost and CEO of DocWorking, Dr. Jen Barna, about how he came to start his own company to help physicians find their ideal work-life balance. Dr. John Mehall shares his personal story about finding the right job and his initial struggle with burnout and work-life balance. Today’s episode covers many important topics for physicians, such as the importance of setting boundaries and knowing when to say no, recognizing when you’re not happy at work or at home, and how to avoid the feeling of being on a  “hamster wheel” in relation to work responsibilities. Both Dr. Barna and Dr. Mehall acknowledge the many benefits of jobs with defined working conditions and also discuss the many advantages of physician locum tenens work. Dr. Mehall emphasizes the importance of defining what makes you happy as a physician, and how a good physician recruiter can help you do so. 

At Curative, Dr. John Mehall and his team work with physicians and advanced practitioners to first define what matters most to them, and then help them find the best job that allows them to pursue these values and goals.

John R. Mehall, MD, MBA, FACS, FACC

Dr. Mehall attended Yale University and Southern Methodist University, earning degrees in Philosophy and Biology with Honors before going to The University of Texas for Medical School. Following a decade of surgical training, he became a nationally recognized expert in minimally invasive heart surgery, performing over 4000 operations, speaking at over 20 national meetings, and published over 50 scientific articles.  For ten years, Dr. Mehall served as the Director of Cardiothoracic Surgery for Centura Health leading 15% year over year growth during that time.  He was also the Co-Chair of the CommonSpirit Health National Cardiovascular Service Line.

Beyond clinical medicine, Dr. Mehall founded seven healthcare businesses and earned an MBA from The University of Texas with Honors. He has served as the Chief Medical Officer for Curative/Doximity since 2019.  Dr. Mehall is a partner in a healthcare private equity firm.

Outside of work, Dr. Mehall enjoys activities in the Colorado outdoors with his wife and children.

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Podcast produced by: Mara Heppard

 

Please enjoy the full transcript below

 

John:  There is no perfect job that will find you, because you have to know what you’re looking for and either find that or create that.

[DocWorking theme]

Jen: Thank you for joining us here today on DocWorking: The Whole Physician Podcast. I want to take a moment and let you know that we’ve been working around the clock at DocWorking to bring you CME credits, so that now you can let your continuing education budget help you to prioritize your own wellness and get on the path to living your best life. Everything we do at DocWorking is specifically designed with you in mind. We hope you’ll head over to docworking.com today and take our two-minute quiz to find out where you are right now on the balance to burnout continuum. Take our burnout quiz and this simple step alone can put you in the right direction toward living your best life.

Welcome to DocWorking: The Whole Physician Podcast. I’m Dr. Jen Barna, founder and CEO of DocWorking and cohost of the podcast. Thank you so much for joining us today. If you are a physician who wants to maximize your potential on your own terms and live your best life, you have come to the right place. If you’re interested in affordable coaching programs that earn you CME and accelerate your path to getting where you want to be, please check us out at docworking.com. And today, I’m thrilled to have with me Dr. John Mehall, who is joining me as a guest and I know you’re going to really enjoy this conversation about how to find the right job to help prevent burnout, and what you need to know about yourself in order to be able to accomplish that. Dr. John Mehall is a nationally recognized expert in minimally invasive cardiac surgery, and previously was the Director of Cardiothoracic Surgery for Centura Health, where he developed his own thriving practice serving much of Colorado. And additionally founded seven healthcare businesses over the years and currently serves as the Chief Medical Officer for Curative, the staffing and recruiting branch of Doximity. Dr. John Mehall, welcome to DocWorking: The Whole Physician Podcast.

John: Thanks so much. I’m really privileged to be here, Jen, and thanks for having me.

Jen: I’m so happy to have you here because I really am excited to talk with you about burnout, and how physicians come to that point, and how common it is. You have accomplished so much in your career as a nationally recognized expert, cardiac surgeon, you’ve successfully founded seven healthcare businesses and what I would love to know is, how is your personal work-life balance?

John: Well, today, it’s going really well, but only because I’ve gone through significant transformation in realigning my priorities, and what makes me happy, and how I define myself, and how I define success.

Jen: I would love to talk with you about that process, and how your career went, and at what point you decided to begin to define that for yourself, and at what point you recognized that you needed to define that?

John: Sure, and I’ll be happy to. So, my journey began like everybody else’s where you’re working hard, and doing well in school, and trying to distinguish yourself, so you can get into the next level and phase of training. I think that then creates a very goal-oriented mentality and you say, “Okay, I’ve got to go achieve this goal” and then when you achieve it, that brings you self-esteem and self-worth, and I did that through college and medical school, and then went on to 10 years of residency training and fellows, you know, pre-80-hour workweek in a somewhat brutal environment. But that’s where your formative years are. And so, then, I really felt like, “Okay, I’m going to define myself by how many cases I do, and how much more personal sacrifice I can do than my fellow colleagues, and how much money I can make, and how many publications I can achieve, and how many podiums I get on?”

And then when I entered into practice, probably, really continued that pattern and maybe redefined it some as, how big can I build the practice, how far can I extend my referral pattern? Really just ran on that hamster wheel very hard, and if I think back about it now, it’s astonishing to think that on two separate occasions, I actually flew home from one of the few family vacations we took, once to do a really complicated case that then resulted in a case report and another time to do a demonstration of the robot for a potential donor, who eventually gave us a bunch of money. The idea that I somehow put those things ahead of spending time with my family on vacation when I almost never went on vacation, it’s hard to believe I actually did that.

Jen: And so, was that the point at which you began to recognize that maybe you needed to make a change or what happened that made you realize that?

John: I would say two things. One is, one of the hardest things that anybody has to learn to do is to say no. As you start to get success, it’s like the snowball rolling down the hill, and it gets bigger and bigger, and the things that you’re asked to do, whether it’s new responsibilities, or speaking at something, or teaching someone something, get bigger and bigger, so then it’s like, “Oh, yes, I would absolutely do that.” You feel really honored that someone asked, and then all you do is, you continue to put things on your plate and you don’t take anything off. I got to the point where I had so many things on my plate that I knew that I could not do all of them well and in fact, I was doing all of them not as well as I knew that I could do them, probably satisfactory, but it was very unsatisfying personally to do a whole bunch of things in a mediocre fashion. And so, I think that was part of it.

And the other part of it was the toll I could see that it was taking on my family as my kids got older. Little kids don’t tell you that they miss you, but as they get older and you’re missing their events or you’re literally running out of the hospital, I remember I was trying to get to a dance recital and I was hurtling so much that I hit the curb leaving the parking lot and got a flat tire, and just think, “What am I doing?” My wife is just a warrior and I can’t thank her enough and she’s been phenomenal to hold all the pieces together and keep all the balls in the air for all the time that I was gone and I realized that that was at risk, too. So when I wasn’t happy at work, because I was trying to do too many things and doing them poorly, I wasn’t happy at home and my family wasn’t happy, I thought something’s got to change.

Jen: Well, you bring up a really important point, which is that our families do make a huge sacrifice when we partake in the culture that we train through the culture, as you say so well, train us to be in a mindset where we are sacrificing ourselves, we think for the greater good, but ultimately, it’s not sustainable and our families do often pay the price. So that’s wonderful that you were able to recognize that and make changes that led you to a path of having a better work-life balance. It’s interesting how that ties into your entrepreneurship, how would you say that that influenced what you did in terms of your business side?

John: Well, I first left training and went into a private practice with four people. I was recruited to replace someone that was retiring. When that person retired, he was really the glue that had held everything together and the whole thing quickly imploded. Two of us became hospital employees at one of the hospitals, and I realized very early on that the fundamental structure of how most hospitals engage in employment with physicians is really broken. Most hospitals engage with physicians in independent contracts and then what the result was that you’re in essence competing with your partner, and so each of you has usually a highly productivity-based contract and, if you want to do more work, it usually comes at the expense of your partner, and, at least in the surgical specialty, everybody wants to be busy, and so then it results in case hoarding and other things. I might get a consult on Wednesday, but I don’t have over time until Monday and I’ll just park the patient in the hospital until Monday, when potentially one of my partners could have done it on Thursday or Friday. And that, when you’re then asked to share call and do other things where you want to behave as a community, those two things are fundamentally at odds, and I really found it a difficult way to interact and I also was in a situation where my original practice, there were two of us, and the hospital unceremoniously terminated the other person and left me alone, and they were very inept at recruiting. I was not involved in the process and spent over a year doing call every night. They were very unempathetic in getting me additional help and call relief, and that had a huge burden on my family.

And when we finally did hire somebody, maybe wasn’t the best fit and then a year later that person left. And so, at that point, it was obvious that there were fundamental flaws with the model and I’m sure that I wasn’t perfect and maybe I contributed in some way, but the model itself didn’t seem sustainable to me and I wanted to get into a model where I was able to recruit people that I felt were good partners, we could collaborate, we didn’t have a built in financial competition between us, and contract with the hospital as a group rather than as individuals. And naturally, having never done that before, their answer was, “No, no, can’t do it, not compliant, never done it before.” and so I gave them a word of notice that I was leaving.

And when they were faced with having nobody after already having 18 months of recruiting challenges we asked then, we got into a structure where we contracted as a group with group incentives, and shared finances, and things like that and we’ve been in a model like that for a decade ever since. It’s been very, very good. It’s very symbiotic. We certainly can’t live without the hospital, the health system. They can’t live without us. But it does allow us to do things where we have some shared financial incentives between the members of the group. We don’t hoard cases, we try and do what’s most efficient for the patient in the hospital, we’re able to do some self-governance, we direct our own recruiting, we’re able to share patient between sites as we cover multiple surgical sites. It’s really aligned all of our incentives and been a much healthier model.

Jen: That’s really interesting that you chose to deal with all of that being put in basically a solo position inadvertently by fixing the problem in that way. I actually share a similar story. My first position outside of residency, I was being hired to join two other radiologists. When I got there, I was the only radiologist. I was solo.

John: Shocker.

Jen: Yeah. I was solo straight out of residency, which it was a situation also where my backup evening system that was a remote coverage after 5 PM was also removed and then it was a 24/7 slog basically with a four-day-a-week contract. My solution ultimately to that was to leave. I fixed what I could. I brought two people in and then actually we ended up leaving together. But I think the model that you propose is an excellent model at which ultimately, I found in private practice and have been with a group who works with a similar model to that, and I think that could be a really promising way to look at structuring physician relationships with healthcare systems and hospitals.

Speaking of being in a situation where you feel like your only alternative is to look elsewhere. There are so many things that you and I have talked about in terms of financial issues that physicians end up basically putting themselves into a trap with delayed gratification for years through residency and fellowship, and then getting a little bit ahead of themselves once they are earning money, because they have debt and other expenses that physicians can end up feeling trapped and overwhelmed, and that can lead to burnout. So I’d love to just hear your insights. You’re an expert, having started a recruiting company that ultimately has become Curative, which is a branch of Doximity. And so, I would love to hear about your experience. How you became interested in physician recruiting and what you recommend for someone who may find themselves in a position where they are indeed looking for an alternative to where they are?

John: I got into the staffing business somewhat inadvertently, where we had built a large surgical group. In the Mountain West, there’s a lot of small practices, and people were calling us asking if we could help with coverage. I had some partners who were a little bit older, had kids out of the house, and were interested in doing that type of work. We started placing people around the Mountain West and that grew beyond cardiac surgeons into cardiology, and vascular surgery, and perfusionists, and a host of other businesses. The business really got bigger than I could manage and I was fortunate enough to reconnect with a friend from college who was in the healthcare staffing business and then Doximity bought our business. We have been working as Curative ever since.

It’s been wonderful because Doximity brings so much to the table as a living breathing online community of both physicians and advanced practitioners that it covers almost 90% of physicians now, and their sole mission is really to make the lives of healthcare providers better, and part of that really is helping people find work that is meaningful and structured in a way that they aren’t burned out and they aren’t in these toxic situations. And so, at Curative we spend a lot of time really trying to understand what people really want. I’m a big fan of Naval Ravikant. He would say, “It’s easy to do what you want. It’s hard to know what you want.”

A lot of times when physicians are changing jobs, it’s because they probably got into a situation which didn’t really meet their needs, because they didn’t understand what they wanted, and if we’re going to help them move to either another permanent job or another type of work such as locums or fixed to define boundary type work, then it’s really important to peel that onion and see what is really important to them, what do they not like about their current situation, what about them themselves is either making the situation better or worse, because whenever they go to a new job, they’re going to take themselves, and their preferences, and their biases with them, and make that a good fit. I think that’s really critical.

Jen: I think another thing that can lead to a decision to leave is sometimes our culture also has taught us not to step forward and admit that we’re unhappy with something, or admit that we’re having a problem with something, or we’re struggling with something. I think we’re perhaps even more inclined to leave and go try to start fresh somewhere else rather than come forward and say, “You know what, I’m having a problem with this.” It’s what you mentioned before, setting boundaries. People just say, “This is not working for me, this needs to be fixed, how can we fix it and troubleshoot that?” Again, I think when physicians are in a situation where they have a trusted thinking partner and a coach, for example, they can talk through scenarios like that, and get the confidence to go back and negotiate with a more willing group or administration then they realized, it’s not a case of black or white, there’s a lot that can be done.

John: You touched on four or five really good points there. The first is you’re right. The system does drive that behavior. Historically, a lot of the surgical training programs and even some of my training was pyramidal. You were really in competition to keep your job with your fellow trainees. That ingrains a certain type of behavior. I know that personally, I can remember being in the scrub sink sick as a dog, but there was no way I was going to not do that case, or say that I couldn’t do it, or that I was too tired, whatever the case may be, because it was unacceptable, and so I think you’re right, the system definitely suppresses that type of outreach.

And he other point you made is, when you’re in a system that is toxic, or a job that is not working, or you have that burnout, it is really, really hard to redefine boundaries in the existing situation. It’s not impossible and people can do it, but it’s very difficult. One of the keys to being able to redefine those boundaries is to approach it from a position of strength, and if you are not in a situation financially, where you don’t need to be independently wealthy, but you need to be, at least have some savings and not be having to have a certain amount of cashflow every month just to meet your debt and other needs, and so, that you can say, “You know what? I want to either slow down, I want to go to alternate schedule, I want to do something,” and be able to take the time and have a discussion like that from a position of strength is huge.

And I think lastly, sometimes, if you can’t redefine your situation where you are, it is best to leave, and then you could start with a blank slate, and redefine that how you want. Maybe there’s things about your current job that aren’t right, and the agents at Curative are great at really peeling that out and saying, “You know what? There are fundamental things about what you want that you can’t get where you are and you’d be better to move, and let’s find you a place where things that are important to you are priorities for the institution as well.”

The last thing I would say on that is that if people struggle to set those boundaries, then many times jobs where you have defined time on and time off really, really solves that for the individual. If you are going to go and work somewhere, and you’re going to get on a plane or drive somewhere to do it, and you’re there for three, four or five days, whatever the case may be, and then you know when you’re there, you’re all in. You’re engaged in work, you don’t have family obligations, your family knows that you’re there working. When you come back, you’re all engaged in family, and you’re not working, and somebody else you know is there handling those things, and the boundaries are drawn for you. For a lot of people that’s very, very appealing and that really fits what they need.

And we’ve also discovered that certainly one of the things that led me into this business because I had older partners who were interested in traveling, so through the course of running a staffing business, we discovered that there are certain subgroups of people that very much like, I hate to it use the word ‘locums’, because it has somewhat of a negative connotation, but really defined work and temporary work where you go somewhere, you do the work and you leave, has a lot of advantages, and those advantages include someone who has a dual working family, and especially if the other person is not in medicine, and they have a corporate job somewhere, and they’re not really movable. But for in your specialty, there’s not a great situation there where you’re excited about working, and in those situations, a lot of people will choose to say, “I’m going to go spend a defined amount of time, whatever that is, one week or something, somewhere else.”

There’s a woman that I’ve gotten to know very well, where her husband has an oil and gas job in a place where there’s really no work for her and she chooses to spend one week a month at the Navajo reservation doing primary care. It’s been very, very rewarding, and she engages in that work while she’s there, and then when she goes back home, she knows that she has the rest of the month to spend with her kids and her family. It’s been a way where she has found work that’s very rewarding, and she enjoys it, and she’s not conflicted with trying to see one more patient, and then get to soccer practice or whatever the case may be. And so, those kinds of things work very, very well.

The other situations we’ve seen is where somebody goes through a divorce, and their children are now living somewhere else, and there’s no job for them there, and they want to live by their kids, but then take the time that they don’t have with their kids and go work somewhere else. That’s been a very successful solution for those folks to allow them to spend good quality time with their children and still have a meaningful work experience. There’re a lot of scenarios like that. I think there’re things that people probably don’t even know exist like, you could work on a cruise ship for two weeks, or you can work on a cruise ship for a month. You can do a lot of things like that, and it gives you clear-cut defined boundaries.

For people that are looking to slow down, but they don’t want to quit entirely, doing locums in defined periods of time is really very effective, because one of the things that people forget is that there’s a huge amount of non-clinical work that is put on employed physicians. We need you to sit on this pharmacy committee, we need you to sit on this quality thing, we need you to do these other things.

Jen: While you’re working on a productivity model. [laughs]

John: Right. That’s right. Oh, yeah. Yeah, yeah. We’re going to give you a bunch of work that is non-productivity, but we’re still going to only pay you on your productivity. That’s very common. You’re right. And also, depending on your specialty, there’s a certain amount of referral and referring physician, management, and business roles. You call it business development or CRM. But you have to maintain those referral physician relationships. What’s nice about, if you’ve done that for 10 or 20 years and you’re saying, “I’m tired of that. My kids are out of the house, and maybe I’ll go with my wife, and we’ll work one week a month in Montana, and I don’t have to sit on a committee, I don’t have to work on any of these other things, I get to take care of the patients, and provide for them, and keep my skills up, and I’m able to earn enough money to cover the living expenses for the two of us without tapping into my nest egg” it’s a great solution for those folks.

Jen: And a great solution for physicians who have gotten into that safety zone that you mentioned earlier. I think all of us have to, ideally, if we can start very early in our careers, get ourselves into what I call a safety zone. Like you said, it doesn’t need to be a place of wealth. It just needs to be a place where you can cover your basic needs financially, so that you do have that flexibility to come back and negotiate your schedule where you are or look at other options. If you want to cut back to look at some other models, locums is a great way.

John: I think it’s very challenging and physicians are probably insufficiently aware and insufficiently educated to navigate the time from transitioning from training into practice. The things that are hard about that are you’ve lost some of the time value of money because you weren’t really earning in your 20s, and so, now your timeline and horizon to retirement, and college savings, and these other things are shorter. That is a burden. You’re leaving with a high amount of debt.

For most physicians, when you go from residency training to practice, you get a huge jump in salary, but you forget that it’s probably going to be pretty flat thereafter for the rest of your career while your expenses are likely to go up as you get kids. It’s very, very difficult and you’ve got pent up demand from all the sacrifices you’ve made over the decades. When you hit that those crucial couple years, if you don’t set up a plan to service debt, don’t set up a plan to save for retirement, overindulge in lifestyle or pent-up demand, then you’d do that for 5 or 10 years, and you’re that much further in the whole, and savings, and the time value of money creation. So, that’s something I think I certainly was totally unaware of and hadn’t thought about in those terms when I was entering practice. I was just like, “Hallelujah, I’m finally going to get a decent paycheck and I can buy my wife something nice.” If you overdo that or you don’t thread that needle well, then it makes getting into that safety zone that you define very, very difficult once you’re 45 or 50.

Jen: I would say, if you’re listening to this and you’re early in your career, take it from those of us who are looking back with hindsight, because hindsight is 2020. One of the reasons that I’ve started DocWorking is because of all of the mistakes that I made and then looking back and saying, “Wow, those could have been avoided, if only I had known.” If you’re in the middle of your career, and you’re realizing, “Uh-oh, is it too late for me? I’ve made some mistakes.” No, it’s not too late, it’s never too late. You can begin to make changes. If you’re early in your career, you can listen to our mistakes and learn from those, so that you don’t make them, which I think, hopefully, a lot of people are going to do.

But if you’re in a situation where you are mid-career and you’re looking at making some major changes, one thing that you and I have also talked about is just defining what happiness means to you as a step toward making the decision whether to stay or go. If ultimately you decide to go, then when you’re making that choice really defining what matters most to you in that case. How do you guys work with people to do that at Curative?

John: Yeah, I think that’s a great point because if you don’t know what you really want, you’re never going to find it. There is no perfect job that will find you because you have to know what you’re looking for and either find that or create that. When you are a physician agent, or recruiter, or whatever term you want to give them, and you’re working with literally hundreds of physicians every year, and you’re helping them navigate that process, then those folks learn very quickly to really dig in and help people, do some introspection and do some self-discovery to understand what is important to them, why are they currently unhappy, what kind of attributes and characteristics of a job are going to make them happy? Those are going to be very different for everybody.

In most cases, they’re actually not money or financial rewards. They’re usually things around the working conditions, the schedule, the ability to either do things with your family, do hobbies, do self-care, whatever it may be. The team at Curative does that all day every day. You’ve got hundreds of people really working with hundreds of physicians each across the spectrum of specialties. With all the resources of Doximity, who really have spent their entire decade of their existence building tools for physicians to help make physicians’ and advanced practitioners’ lives easier. I think they have the expertise to do that.

I think there’s some degree of self-interest. If we at Curative are placing somebody into a job, we want them to be successful, both because we want them to think we did a good job for them and we want the hospital or the employer to think that we did a good job in finding the right person. Obviously, we have incentive to do that well. But I think you can’t just go and drop someone in a job because they’ve liked the paycheck, because it’s never a solution for long-term success.

Jen: What do you say to a physician who asks, “Should I use a recruiter or not?” A lot of physicians don’t know anything about the process of finding a job. What to look for in a recruiter to know that it’s the right person to work with?

John: Sure. Well, the first thing I would say is finding a job and navigating that process, whether you’re just leaving residency training or you’ve been out in the workforce, is something that most physicians are not adept at. That’s not through any fault of their own. They’re certainly sufficiently intelligent. But it’s because through all steps of their training, there’s a very clear rubric of, “If you do this, then you will get an A on this assignment. If you do this, then you’ll get into medical school. If you do this, you’ll finish residency, et cetera, et cetera.”

When it comes to finding a right job, there’s not really a clear rubric for that of how to do it. I used to give a lot of presentations at meetings to residents about how to find a job. Navigating their process is very foreign to them, because it doesn’t have clear rules or guidelines. Given that background, why would you not lean on the experience and the resources of someone who does that every day and has years of experience doing that? They’re going to ask you some questions that more often than not, you’re going to raise your eyebrows and say, “Well, I never thought about that.” There are going to be things that you probably haven’t considered that are really, really critically important to your success in that role.

Jen: It’s like using a real estate agent when you buy a house, isn’t it? I would think the vast majority of people would never consider going out independently without an agent, just looking at houses, because an agent brings so much to the table to help you through the process.

John: That’s exactly right. The real estate agent is a great analogy and everybody uses one to buy a house. But finding a job is an exponentially larger financial decision than buying a house. So, why are you not having somebody help you? It could be helping you both find the right job, helping you understand the characteristics of the job, helping you understand yourself and what you’re looking for. And then also, some of the pieces around contractual negotiations, and what is normal for the industry, and things like that. You’re absolutely right. It’s a huge financial decision, and it’s very costly to change jobs, and we’ve all seen friends or colleagues who have gotten onto this merry-go-round of changing jobs every couple of years, and it’s very detrimental to career success in many ways. So, having a recruiter or agent person to help you with that process is extremely important.

Jen: Well, John, it’s been such a pleasure talking with you. We’ve hit on so many interesting topics. I think we’re definitely going to have to revisit some of these topics. I really appreciate you taking the time to come and talk with me today. I hope if you’re listening that you have found a lot of value in the conversation that I’ve had with Dr. John Mehall today. And how can people find you if they would like to learn more about you and ask you some additional questions?

John: You can find me through curativetalent.com, certainly through doximity.com and on LinkedIn would probably be the best ways to connect.

Jen: Wonderful. Thank you, Dr. John Mehall for joining me today on DocWorking: The Whole Physician Podcast. If you’re listening today and you’re interested in maximizing your own potential, preventing burnout as a side effect of maximizing your potential and living your best life, please reach out to us at docworking.com and check out our programs with DocWorking Thrive. Thank you, again, and we look forward to seeing you next time on DocWorking: The Whole Physician Podcast.

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Jen: At DocWorking, we’re here to help you maximize your potential on your own terms and help you live your best life. You told us what you need and want and we built this for you. Whatever your journey is, you have options. You can choose to live the life you want to live. We see you, we get you, and now, let’s get you in the driver’s seat of your own life, so you can find purpose in your work, and everything you do, and every choice you make. Top executives, athletes, actors all achieve greatness with the support of professional coaches. As a healthcare professional, you deserve ongoing coaching support toward achieving your career goals and living your best life as you define it on your own terms.

We have created this specifically for you with CME credit at docworking.com. Please go to docworking.com and check out our quick Balance to Burnout Quiz to see where you are on the balance to burnout continuum right now. The results might surprise you. Taking this simple first step may change your life for the better. And until next time, thank you for listening to DocWorking: The Whole Physician Podcast.

 

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